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Not true, people must stop overreacting on everything, seriously.
Most of the viable, useful and playable builds in D2 were built around either specialization in certain skills or a skill tree ( i.e Zealadin ) or certain items ( i.e Bowazon ), and both are still present in D3.
If you people lack the imagination to make a melee wizard in D3 that's your problem not Blizz, stats playing a large, effective role in character customization is a just myth ( calls Myth Busters for help
)
As for making a good Melee Wizard, it is possible. Melee Wizard:-Melee Skills (Focus on the Wizard skills that work good with close combat)
Stone skin
Damage resistance
Weapon mastery
Mirror image
Armor piercing
Magic weapon
Slowing strikes
Conjured armor
Arcane Armor
Storm Armor
Power Armor
Temporal Armor
Lethal Energy
Slow Time
Teleport
-Melee gear (all with modifiers that improve melee combat)
Powerful Sword
Heavy Plate-mail
Heavy Boots, Gloves, Headgear, Pants
Rings and Amulets
So it appears that lack of customization is pure nonsense cause there are enough skills in the Wizard tree ( which i'm sure many didn't even bother to look at ) that scream for people to make a melee wizard, i'm tired of all the whining about "stats" and "no customization" in D3, at least when you say something try to back it up with facts FOR A CHANGE.
Good post.|||Quote:
Most of the viable, useful and playable builds in D2 were built around either specialization in certain skills or a skill tree ( i.e Zealadin ) or certain items ( i.e Bowazon ), and both are still present in D3.
A bowazon is build around stats specialization just as much as items specialization - no dex = bad damage. And eventually, zealadins are good because they don't need that much dex/str to get good defence/block/damage. Force them to take high str/dex - as in, auto placed stats to get max block with bad block shields/low holysheild and to wear heavy armours - and zealadins seem atleast to me much more fragile as it would damage their life greatly.|||Quote:
A bowazon is build around stats specialization just as much as items specialization - no dex = bad damage. And eventually, zealadins are good because they don't need that much dex/str to get good defence/block/damage. Force them to take high str/dex - as in, auto placed stats to get max block with bad block shields/low holysheild and to wear heavy armours - and zealadins seem atleast to me much more fragile as it would damage their life greatly.
Not bad points, but you have to remember that what makes a Bowazon play different from any other amazon build with the same stats is the skills and items used.
Besides, stats works quite differently than in D2, in D3 each one has several effects ( increasing max life, Block, critical chance ... etc etc ), so if items are made in two categories, one that moderately increases a certain stat as a whole ( STR, WILL POWER, .... etc etc ), and one that significantly increases a certain one of those stat effects
directly ( life, critical hit chance, block, .. etc etc ) this will ensure that any build can be complemented by the right items and skills.
Examples would be:-Heavy Chainmail of STR: one of its modifiers would be ( +10 to STR ) which is a stat
-Breastplate of Life: one of its modifiers would be ( +40 to life ) which is a stat effected value
-Claymore of Might: one of its modifiers would be ( +20 to STR ) which is a stat
-Violent Double Axe of Massacre: one of its modifiers would be ( +35% chance to do critical damage ) which is a stat effected value
And so on, now imagine that a crafting system in D3 that allows to modify items and increase their efficiency by a certain percentage ( including increasing their modifiers value ) for a huge cost of gold, now no more tedious stat allocation will be needed if the items had good stat increasing modifiers variety + a crafting system that allows for increasing item quality and its modifiers effects .. specially the stat increasing ones ... volia
|||Actually... interesting point you got there, maybe the new crafting system will be the new attribute customizers?
A little like enchanting from WoW?|||Quote:
Not bad points, but you have to remember that what makes a Bowazon play different from any other amazon build with the same stats is the skills and items used.
I know, though with the same stats, bowazon aren't that good. That's one of the reason why there aren't that many hardcore bowazon.
However, I'm not saying that diablo III will not pull it off. They actually may make it work very well. I'm just saying that diablo II does work on stats quite a bit and that I will feel it as a lost when I can't do anything about stats.
On thing that might work is to get different pre-set lines; One forinstance would focus on heavily on mana or vitality - or what ever will be the equivalence - making in interesting for a pure caster. While an other path might go for an more or less even distribution between the different stats making it better for a mele build. the same can then be done for a barbarian. One that focusses heavily on health and str with a minor focus on the other stats. And one that solely focusses on str - damage - fury and a tiny bit of life.
If you change the stats system to an item-bases system, this will mean that certain items will be much less interesting, simply because they don't offer the needed stats. You are going to use a Claymore of Might meaning that you can't use a Claymore of speed because it doesn't offer the stats you need.
they are different thing thus are best kept as apart as possible.
@ konfeta: why does everyone want things from WOW. Really, if wow were that a good game, I wouldn't be playing diablo, now would I.|||Quote:
However, I'm not saying that diablo III will not pull it off. They actually may make it work very well. I'm just saying that diablo II does work on stats quite a bit and that I will feel it as a lost when I can't do anything about stats.
If you examine Stats carefully you will realize that they are just indirect representations of other important factors ( besides previously working as item caps in D2 which is no more the case in D3) important factors like ( life, block, critical, .. etc etc ) which are what really matters.
So if you have in D3 a passive skill that makes each point in a stat pool more effective ( like the Barb skill the makes each point in STR stat equal more damage ) thus increasing those resultant factors effects, then it is no different than manually increasing the stat itself.
And if the crafting system can modify items then the game becomes really what it should be, focusing on customizing characters using a large selection of items and skills.
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If you change the stats system to an item-bases system, this will mean that certain items will be much less interesting, simply because they don't offer the needed stats. You are going to use a Claymore of Might meaning that you can't use a Claymore of speed because it doesn't offer the stats you need.
If you are going for a fast attacking build take the Claymore of Speed, if going for the brute builds then use the Claymore of Might, and if you want a bit of both there could be a unique Claymore that offers a small bonus to both stats, or just find another item than the claymore to increase the wanted stat, so now getting the right items will be critical and different from player to player depending on their selected skills ( clearly made in D3 with specializations chances in mind )
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why everyone doesn't want anything from WOW. Really, if wow wasn't a good game there wouldn't be millions of Blizzard fans playing it, now would they.
/Fixed
Ahm, actually the WoW hate is getting kinda ridiculous, just because you don't like WoW as a whole ( and it surely has its problems ) doesn't mean it doesn't have good ideas, and those good ideas will benefit Diablo 3 and make it a better game which ALL that matters regardless of the origin of the idea .. it just has be viewed separate from it source and have its benefits logically examined, mindlessly refusing ideas just cause they are related to WoW is illogical.|||Quote:
If you examine Stats carefully you will realise that they are just indirect representations of other important factors ( besides working as item caps ) important factors like ( life, block, critical, .. etc etc ) which are what really matters.
So if you have in D3 a passive skill that makes each point in a stat pool more effective ( like the Barb skill the makes each point in STR stat equal more damage ) thus increasing those resultant factors effects, then it is no different than manually increasing the stat itself.
You are going from a 3 layer system to a 2 layer system where the 3th layer is simulated in the 2 remaining Layer. That ain't the same. Now stats like system will be in competition with direct skills and with items.
It's kind of like a hardware. Each hardware component has different layers, going from a physical layer over some sort of interface to software and all those complicated things. Why do they do this, because combining layers just can't offer the same functionally/safety as different layers.
In short, cutting down a layer is only acceptable when it give huge improvements towards balancing - atleast for me. Strangely, you find lots of reasons , though balancing isn't one of them. And that surprises me.
@Knight_Wolf: the problem isn't that enchanting is part of wow. The problem is that it appears to me that konfeta likes the idea simply because it's part of wow and simply because it works there. Diablo ain't wow so simply taking over idea doesn't work.|||Quote:
@Knight_Wolf: the problem isn't that enchanting is part of wow. The problem is that it appears to me that konfeta likes the idea simply because it's part of wow and simply because it works there. Diablo ain't wow so simply taking over idea doesn't work.
The real problem is that you assumed two things without much evidence.1-You assumed Konfeta likes the idea JUST because it is in WoW, actually i never played WoW nor did i know that enchanting in WoW is any similar to what i wish the Crafting system in D3 to be, i think he merely used the WoW example as reference, which doesn't mean in any way that the crafting system in D3 must be exactly identical to the WoW enchanting ( whatever it is )
2-You also assumed that JUST because it is a mechanic from WoW that it simply won't work in D3 ( which is what the majority of WoW haters do ), that's very biased thinking and things in game development don't work purely on personal preference, if it was tested and proven that the crafting system that allows to modify/enhance items will make D3 a better game then it must be included in the game regardless of anyone's preferences.
Personally i think a system like that will make the game impressive, the limitless possibilities to modify items will result in almost endless variations of items ( modifications with some limits for balance ), for example every item can only be modified one time and the player can only modify one of the item aspects ... plus .. the more important/effective that aspect is the more gold the player will pay to get that modification which will make a good gold sink.
With this no longer will we have 100 players with identical copies of the same gear, instead each player will modify his gear respectively to fit his skills and play style.|||Quote:
2-You also assumed that JUST because it is a mechanic from WoW that it simply won't work in D3 ( which is what the majority of WoW haters do )
There is just as little reason to assume the opposite.
anyway, lets give this thread back the melee wizard shall we?|||Quote:
There is just as little reason to assume the opposite
Actually there is no reason to assume it won't work before testing it out, so Blizz is the only one who has an actual say in this matter ( not the angry WoW haters ), let's leave it at that ( or maybe until they actually reveal what kind of crafting system they have on mind for D3 to replace the Cube )
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anyway, lets give this thread back the melee wizard shall we?
Ok, so what kind of Melee Wizard variations do you have in mind.
I think it is possible to make a speed based melee Wizard be investing a lot in these skills:
Slowing strikes
Slow Time
Teleport
Mirror image
All of them allow the wizard some space to move and slow his/her enemies to a crawl, combined with gear that increases Hit%, Dodge%, Block% and Running speed this wizard will move very quickly, distract the enemies, stop their projectiles and be able to inflict damage on them before they can even react.
Another option would be making a brute melee wizard by investing heavily in those skills for example:
Stone skin
Damage resistance
Weapon mastery
Armor piercing
Magic weapon
Slowing strikes
Power Armor
Lethal Energy
With this many physical enhancements abilities this wizard can really deal lots of physical damage ( given a good weapon ) and stand a lot of punishment ( and could even tank if the gear provides a life/vitality bonus )
Mix some medium range magic skills with any of the above builds and you will get a very versatile and effective warlock at your command.
So what are your dream builds for a melee wizard ?
Played a duo summoner in Titan Quest. :P|||Quote:
|||In diablo 3, you have mirror image and slow time. Though not a "complete" replacement, those spells can give you the time to cast enough spells to get rid of your enemies.
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So, no viable melee Wizards unfortunately I guess.|||Raven, you do know that the Wizard has multiple skills that are melee ranged, plus armors, plus no stat reqs on weapons or armor. That sounds like a melee wizard to me.|||Quote: